Many thanks to Anne for taking and preparing these notes {:-))

COFFEE AND CHAT 21/3/2000

NOTES


1. The meeting was opened at 10.00am by John Saxon when there were 45 people
present.

2. Charlie reported on the financial status of the group and then raised the
question of the policy regarding the loan of items purchased by the group.
It was agreed that preference for loans should always be given to those
members of Coffee and Chat who are listed on the current attendance lists
but that other members of PCUG could also borrow when the items were not in
use.  Members agreed that it was preferable for loans to be made, and
returned, at the Coffee and Chat meetings but that some exceptions could be
made.  It was decided that Charlie would discuss the matter with Petra and
then a set of guidelines could be developed governing all future loans.
Members were reminded that the list of items for loan was kept on top of the
filing cabinet. 21/3

3. John mentioned a US company at www.bigredwire.com which would provide one
telephone call per day, costing up to $8, free providing members went to
their webpage and canceled the item off their bill.  The only problem was
that the company had to be allowed to make their system the default one for
members' telephones.  However, if members wanted to use another system at
any stage they could always dial the necessary prefix to allow them to
access it. 21/3

4. Phillip proposed forming a group similar to Coffee and Chat for absolute
beginners where all members could ask questions as the current group is too
big, and new people came and then tended to drop out - perhaps because they
were intimidated by the large forum.  The new group could be held on a
different day and contain a mix of absolute beginners and some experts.  It
was agreed that Phillip should raise the matter on the newsgroups including
C & C, and TIP general. 21/3

5. A general discussion ensued.  Jeff suggested that a briefing be given
each meeting on different types of software, while Gloria, who runs a C & C
for another group, disagreed and felt that the meetings should be informal
where members were given an opportunity to ask questions and learn from one
another.  Her C & C., which contains 10-12 members of mixed abilities,
worked very well.  Mike suggested that public libraries could steer people
to the beginners group. 21/3

6. Merv mentioned that members of the present C & C try not to intimidate
new people.  He felt that beginners should be advised not to be afraid and
to bear with the discussion even if they do not initially understand it and
things would begin to drop into place and the jigsaw make sense.  John
agreed and felt that beginners should be told that it is very hard to damage
a computer and encouraged to get in and try things out after looking at the
options, and reading the manual and the help files.  Esther confirmed that
while at first she found C & C very difficult she persevered and although
she is still not an expert she knows who she can contact for help. 21/3

7. Ken described the style he adopted for his letters with a watermark at
the top, and a spot 10 spaces down and one in for the address to which the
letter was to be sent, and circulated a copy. 21/3

8. Ken also circulated copies of material produced by one of the
stallholders at the computer markets which provided comments on each of the
venues, and listed the prices asked for various items on the different
dates.  This material is provided on  www.cheap-pc.homepage.com and gives a
guide to current prices. 21/3

9. He also noted that if members sign up for TPG's paid service they cannot
sign up for the free one, they have to use a different username.  Mike
mentioned that the ISP's charge of $20 a month was very reasonable as it
also covered free cable TV access once it became available. 21/3

10. At the computer show Ken saw a battery operated quick link pen which was
like a highlighter and not much bigger.  It contains OCR software and can
store up to 1000 A4 pages and can be plugged into the serial port of a
computer and the material downloaded.  It cost $360. 21/3

11. Anne queried whether Corel5 was compatible with Windows 98 as she used
to use the program without problem but once 98 was loaded she could not
locate the clipart even after a full installation of the program.  It was
mentioned that the clipart was usually not copied from the CD to the hard
disk .  Merv suggested that she may have got the path wrong and suggested
that she use Windows Explorer to open up the actual files on the CDs to find
it.  If she was asked to associate them she should tick the associate box.
Alternatively, John suggested that she use a free program "associate" to
force the association.  Another possibility was that Anne had mislaid a 3rd
CD disk, which has the clipart on it! 21/3

12. Neville enquired whether it was valid to format C a computer with
Windows 3.1 on it and then install Windows 95, using a CD from someone else
who had registered the software but no longer needed it, and then get
downloads to update it.  Jim noted that the license agreement specifically
said that the software was not to be resold.  A discussion of the problem
this posed then ensued. 21/3

13. Greg mentioned that when on a recent computer aid trip he had come
across a modem which swung from tone dialing to pulse dialing which posed
problems as the modem couldn't connect with the ISP using the latter system.
He queried whether it was usual for modems to look at the line and change
dialing methods according to the conditions and was assured that it was
unusual and that the difficulty was probably caused by a software problem.
21/3

14. Greg also mentioned the problems faced by those who had either bought
new computers, or had had them upgraded, and Windows 98 installed who had
not been given the CDs.  Members deplored this. 21/3

15. The order in which icons loaded at start-up was also discussed and it
was agreed that this varied according to which software programs had been
used last and that the variation should not pose any problems. 21/3

16. Wolfe mentioned problems he had had with "Internet Booster" trying to
load on his machine, and was told that other members had also had
difficulties with this program popping up.  Wolfe was advised that EasyMTU,
which was free, was preferable as it did a good job.  It had to be run in
while logged onto the net, and then determined the norm, set packet sizes
etc. 21/3

17. Wolfe had changed from Money to Quicken and was experiencing some
problems.  He was advised that he could download from the net some patches
which might help.  Ken mentioned that when he tried to re-install Quicken,
the program would not accept his no. and he had to get a new one.  This
entailed a free call within Australia but was very time-consuming. 21/3

18. Wolfe queried whether there was an interest group for those using
Quicken, and was encouraged by John to form one and seek those interested
through C & C newsgroup, tip.training and  tip. General. 21/3

19. Rod bought a Woomera modem which died after three weeks which the firm
is now repairing.  He has also got a problem with his computer and has
formatted C, and re-installed Windows 98 but when the computer is left on
for about 8 hours the colors on the monitor changed.  He was advised that
this was probably due to a hardware problem, and to try another monitor and
check for a monitor EHT problem due to temperature changes. 21/3

20. Jean had difficulties when downloading photographs from the net which
she wished to examine offline rather than printing immediately as she found
that only some were retained in her history files and the others were
missing.  John advised that when the history file was full various pages
were randomly deleted rather than the earliest files being deleted first and
recommended that if she used IE she should use "CacheSentry" to prevent
this.  Gloria suggested that if Jean made the site with the photographs a
favorite and set it to "use off-line" she would not have to bother with the
history file. 21/3

21. Lin mentioned that she had lost the newsgroup on TIP Training, using
Netscape, and that when she had searched for it to re-load it she couldn't
find it.  Merv suggested that she refresh all the groups, and then search
all 16000 of them to relocate and load the newsgroup. 21/3

22. Jeff had recently had to reinstall Windows 98SE and Word 2000 and had
lost some macros "Tools calculate (Expression)".  This used to work
perfectly but now it cannot be found.  He was advised that this macro may
have been included in earlier versions of Word but have been omitted from
Word 2000 and he may have to search the earlier versions.  The manual may be
of some help.  As Jeff does not use Excel he cannot develop the macro there
and then import it into Word which would have been another solution. 21/3

23. Phillip was using McCaffee Virus checker and then he purchased and
installed McCaffee Office which also included the virus checker and so he
then had 2 version's running.  John advised him to use "Add/Remove programs"
to remove the virus checker completely and then re-install a new copy. 21/3

24. Phillip was also having problems with his mouse which kept stopping
working and when he used Control/alt/delete the message "RNAAP not
responding" came up plus the suggestion that he shut down, and then his
machine froze.  Ken suggested that he use Control/F4 to shut down the
machine. 21/3

25. Merv mentioned that he had an e-mail from Vet that there was a virus
affecting mobile phones which blows all the SIMMs.  If members got a call
and the caller was identified there was no problem but if the screen stated
caller unknown, the call should be cancelled immediately.  Charlie mentioned
that a hoax message was being circulated regarding mobile phones and this
might have been it. 21/3

26. A query was made as to where e-mails with attachments which were sent
through Netscape were stored on the receiving computer.  They were thought
that they may be be saved in Windows/Temp (per Outlook Express), but they
are more likely to be in a sub-folder of Netscape/User name. Members were
advised to "Save As" to ensure that they were saved in a more appropriate
file. 21/3

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