Meeting 7 September 1999


 


Notes of C&C Meeting 7 September 1999 

1. Ted, who chaired the meeting, opened it at 10.00am with about 33
people in attendance.  A few other people arrived later.

2. Two new members attended the meeting. Larry, who lives in O'Connor,
has owned a computer for about a year but has only just started to use
it.  He is a raw beginner and is attending the meetings to pick up
tips.  Rod, who lives in McGregor, bought his first computer in 1985
and has been working in the computer industry for some years.  As he
is semi-retired, he now has the time to attend meetings.  He uses his
computer for such things as editing magazines rather than play.

3. Ted explained about the SIG's willingness to provide an experienced
member to form a link between it and new members.  The link person
would be available to talk with the new member before meetings and
answer any queries they may have.  Both new members were offered a
link person. 

4. George reminded the group that on their first visit, new members
were not expected to pay $2 for their coffee and that life members and
the note-taker also did not have to pay.

5. Wolf, the Treasurer assured members that the SIG's financial
situation was healthy.

6. Wolf also reminded those present that the PCUG was formed so that
users could help users and urged that people should attempt to make a
contribution in return for the help they received.  He suggested that
Coffee and Chat create a pool of people who could take it in turns to
take the notes.  Ted agreed and noted that people who undertook to do
the job on a long-time basis tended to get worn out.  Volunteers were
sought to join a panel of note-takers.  Offers to do so were received
from John, Ted (when he was not chairing the meeting) and Anne and one
other person.

7. Jeff suggested that a previous custom be revived, and people asking
questions be requested to give a summary of their inquiry to the
note-taker. This was agreed to be a good idea.

8. John queried whether the Coffee and Chat notes were needed.  The
group noted that a lot of people who do not belong to the SIG read the
notes. Emil mentioned that the problem of confining the notes to the
TIP newsgroups was that only those using TIP could gain ready access
to the newsgroups and so if the notes were confined to them a lot of
people would be unable to see  them.  However, if it were decided to
put the notes on the Web page, their availability there would have to
be well publicised.  Terry queried whether it would be feasible to
have a link from the Web page to the newsgroups. John pointed out that
people have to have their machines set up to read the newsgroups, and
that not all members knew how to do this.  He also advised that there
was no public access to the newsgroups because the work involved
in making them available was very volunteer intensive and that were
newsgroups to be publicly accessible they would provide a wide opening
for spamming.

 Chris stated that data in the newsgroups was deleted after a certain
period whereas the material on the Web was archived.  Greg suggested
that people could get details of the Coffee and Chat meetings through
the "Digest", but Chris rejoined that the "Digest" included data on
all PCUG's SIGs.  The idea of asking for an edition of the "Digest"
which was limited to one group was floated.

9. Greg mentioned that he had just returned from a VISE trip helping
people in the bush with their computer problems.  While many of those
he saw had  access to the web some, who used such word processing
packages as "Works", were unable to read material produced using Word
97.  He queried whether there were any inexpensive document readers
and was informed that Microsoft provides free a small application
"Word View" which would help.  The URL is: 
http://officeupdate.microsoft.com/downloaddetails/wd97vwr32.htm. 
 Chris also advised that Microsoft applications had a facility to read
material produced by other word-processing packages.

10. Ron mentioned that some people in the outback, who were using very
high powered accountancy packages for business purposes, had machines
whose bios pliant as the clock was wrong.  He asked if this could be
fixed or whether it would be necessary to buy a new bios or
motherboard, and mentioned that he had searched the Web and contacted
motherboard manufacturers for their advice without success.  He was
reluctant to advise people to replace their bios or upgrade their
motherboards as this was expensive and those concerned were frequently
asset rich but short of ready money.

        Tony stated that there was no easy fix, while Merv mentioned
that Computer Associates sold a Y2K tester and a kit that would fix
any problem found.  John noted that it would not be cost effective to
purchase a new bios or a testing kit, as even if the kit found a
problem it would not always be possible to fix it.  Chris warned that
AMI or Award should not be contacted directly as the motherboard
manufacturers bought their bios from a third party and were unable to
answer queries.  He mentioned that the Mr Bios page on the Web gave
details of new bios.  However, the group agreed that those in the bush
should not be advised to flash upgrade their bios' as this could be
very tricky.  Al queried why those concerned were not simply
advised to change the date on their computers and was informed that
this would not work for those who were running high powered
accountancy packages as getting the right date in their Bios's was
essential for their programs to run efficiently.  However, John noted
that a good quick fix for those not using financial packages, for
which the right date was essential, was to change the date in their
bios in 2000 to the right day, and month with 1972 for the year.

11. Elizabeth mentioned that she was still having trouble with e-mail
messages from her daughter.  When she tried to open them she got a
message that she needed to down load several items before she could
read them but that when she tried to do so nothing happened.  The
Internet SIG thought that the problem was caused by the font used in
the messages and advised her to contact her daughter in Israel and ask
her to send her messages in plain text.  Elizabeth had tried to ring
her daughter three times without success. John and Merv agreed to
advise her later on what she should do.

12. Elizabeth was also having trouble with "Profusion" software as it
filled the whole page and did not leave any space for an address line
where she could enter a new URL.  She had obtained advice from the
Internet SIG but it didn't  work.  John offered to go and visit her to
fix the problem.

13. Finally Elizabeth mentioned that while she had plenty of room on
her "D" drive her "C" drive was full and asked how she could move
things from "C" to "D".  John told her that she could not move
applications from one drive to another and that she would have to
re-install them on the other drive.  John also advised that people
should never use the default address when installing programs but
should use the custom install to load programs on the most appropriate
drive or partition.

14. Roger mentioned that Excel 97 was not Y2K compatible and advised
the group to resolve the problem by going to Control panel/Date
tab/short date section to change the way in which the date was written
to dd/mm/yyyy.  John agreed that there must be four digits for the
year, and recommended that three letters be used for the month if
trouble is to be avoided.  It was questionable whether this fix would
work but it would not cause any harm. Phillip advised that if members'
version of Excel from Office 97 was not compatible and providing it
was registered with Microsoft, the company would provide a free
upgrade package on a new disk.  Emil advised that Excel upgrades can
also be obtained from most cover CDs but warned that SR1 upgrade must
be installed before SR2A.

15. Wolf stated that Microsoft could be contacted on (02) 131482 to
obtain the upgrade from Windows 98 to Windows 98 SE, and noted that
while Microsoft provided a complete new version it could only be
installed if there was a previous version on the computer.

16. John mentioned that if people had a previous version of "Works"
Microsoft would upgrade it to version 4A.

17. Anne mentioned that since she had installed a new hard disk with
Windows 98 she could not use her scanner as she had lost a DLL
MFCOLEUI.  She checked Logitech's web page and found nothing and then
rang Logitech who advised that the company had sold it scanner
business a couple of years ago to a business which has since closed
down and so no new drivers would be produced for use with Windows 98.
As she had been advised by Logitech that the DLL was a Windows file
she tried to find it on her Windows 95 CD but this failed as her
machine automatically tried to install this over Windows 98.  John
advised that it was unlikely to be a Windows file if it were not
available through Windows 98 but she could try activating the "Find"
function on her machine and searching on the Windows 95 CD.  However,
he advised that she should reinstall the original drivers for the
scanner on her new "C" drive and that the Drag and File Gold
application which she had used to move the old drivers from her "D"
drive would not work for an application.  Merv suggested that she
uninstall the old drivers first before re-installing them again.  John
was not sure whether this was necessary.  He offered to discuss the
problem of the missing DLL later.  Chris advised that the driver might
be available on "Drivers.com".  Rod mentioned that he had
visited Logitek's web page recently and found updated drivers (version
16) on their support page and offered to brief Anne on it later.

18. Ken mentioned the problem he had been having with his mouse
freezing. He had followed advice to delete "Find Fast" but this didn't
work, however another group had told him to delete "find Fast" and
"Outlook Express" and when he did so the problem resolved.  John
thought it unlikely that "Outlook Express" had caused the problem.
Chris inquired whether Ken's hard disk had clunked just before the
mouse unfroze and advised that if so it was a good sign that his hard
disk was failing and that he would have to get another disk under
warranty or buy one if necessary.  John responded that it was
unlikely that Ken's hard disk was failing as it was a new one.  He
advised that if the hard disk was working while the mouse was frozen
that was a sign that it was accessing some program and suggested that
"Task Info" be used to find out which programs were being used so as
to detect which one was causing the problem.

19. John briefed the meeting on Telstra's "Call Waiting" service and
the problems which he had registering to use it.  "Call Waiting"
enabled people with only one phone line to take the call via their
computer providing it was set up properly and had a voice facility.
Telstra's registration web page is a disaster, and people have to go
round the loup twice to get their application accepted and even then
the service may be full and unable to accept any new members.  John
noted that while the service was free it had several advantages for
Telstra.  While members were using it they couldn't access other
services and it was in the interests of Telstra to let people
talk on the net providing they did so under its control.  Greg noted
that  TCW, which was of great value to the bush, couldn't be used when
Telstra's service was being utilised.  Also as long as messages were
being sent over the telephone lines, there was an economic advantage
to be gained by Telstra who charge the senders of the call even if
"Call Waiting" was free. 

20. John briefed members on the situation concerning his attempts to
obtain a free Maestro modem for the SIG.  He had sent e-mails to
Maestro on 15/7/99, and 5/8/99 and then rang them on 26/8/99 when he
was told that all their e-mails had been lost.  He then sent copies of
all his previous e-mails again on 28/8/99 but as yet has had no
response.  He promised to send one more e-mail in which he would state
that if he did not hear from them, the SIG would buy a modem from US
Robotics.  Greg warned that John should not put Maestro totally
offside as the Farmwide tests, which have not yet been finalised, show
that Maestro's machine is best for the bush.

21. John also noted that he had received his refund cheque from
Microsoft for the purchase price for "Encarta".  Charlie stated that
when he registered "Encarta" he was offered an opportunity to join
"Communique" for a reduced price and queried whether it was worth
taking up.  John replied that many members had been members of
"Communique" and implied that membership wasn't worth it.

22. Wolf stated that his Omega zip drive was playing up and that after
he had last used the back-up and tried to delete it he got the message
"file system error 1026".  He queried whether there was a difference
between the guest installation files on the original zip drive
software and those on the updates.  Merv offered to lend him a disk of
the updated software and a patch to resolve the problem, and Bob
suggested that he meet with Wolf later to "play zips".

23. Margaret said her computer had crashed recently, and that she had
got it running again satisfactorily using her 6-12 backup floppies by
following the advice she got from books. However, she wanted to know
whether the backup information would still be on the floppies or
whether she would need to backup again.  She was advised that the
information would still be on the disks.  However, Chris mentioned
that although she didn't need to do a further backup she probably
should for having re-installed her system some things may have
changed.  John agreed with this advice. 

24. Jim mentioned that he would like to talk to people after the
meeting about their experiences regarding refilling his own ink
cartridges and other consumables for his Epson printer so as to cut
costs.  Wolf replied that he has an Epson but hadn't found anyone who
could refill the cartridges.  Jim also said that he would like to
discuss the quality of paper to be bought and was advised that you get
what you pay for.  It was agreed that some people would resume the
discussion after the meeting.

25. Tony has an HPJ90 which includes a scanner, a fax and an ink jet
printer which has been causing problems for the past few months.  He
found that the solution was to use a tissue to clean the chrome bar.
He also noted that the printer was very messy and tended to spray ink
about.  Merv suggested that Tony could buy a spray can for cleaning
the machine but Tony replied that metho also works.  Merv also advised
Tony to go into the print module on his computer and reduce the
intensity of the ink used to as low as possible as this would prevent
the ink spraying. 

26. John noted that his "Netscape Communicator 4.08" wasn't recording
his history file any more and asked for advice.  Tony was advised that
Netscape was very indiscriminate when it cleaned up its cache and left
very little behind and that this may be why his history file appeared
empty. John also informed him that when Netscape was full it didn't
delete the earliest files but chose files of a simular size to those
which needed to be saved.

27. Colin was having problems with "Internet Explorer" as he did not
appear to have the "Find, send by e-mail" facility?????  He was
advised to go to "Tools/options/programs and select the programs used
for HTML editing, e-mail etc and select the option which he wished to
use. 

28. Moreover, his computer allowed his IE5 dial-up connection box to
come up when he was word processing and automatically connect him to
the Internet. Also it automatically disconnected him when he closed
"Outlook Express". Colin was advised to change his options to "never
dial a connection" and to set the tab to do a manual connection so as
to ensure that the machine could not automatically connect and
disconnect him.

29. Ted then reminded members to put their chairs back and take their
mugs back to the kitchen and closed the meeting at about 11.30am.???

Ane L 7/9/99

******************************************************
Recent Coffee & Chat pages are  available on the internet news group
tip.coffee-chat. 
Archives of past meetings are available at  the web site:
http://www.pcug.org.au/pcug/candc/c&c.htm
These Archives are  searchable, and also include some minutes
of the Internet SIG, run on alternate Mondays
*******************************************************

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