Co-ordinator Alf opened the meeting by welcoming all 37 members, including two new members, Denise (ex-CSIRO, but now doing contract work) and John (long-time PCUG member from Cooma). Wolf described the delicious array of food which has been arranged for the C & C Melbourne Cup Luncheon next Monday 4/11/97 at the PCUG Centre at 1230 for 1300 hrs. Although 24 had expressed their intentions to attend, not all have paid the subsidised cost of $8 each. Prepayment is necessary, so please contact Wolf (at 6258 5250) to arrange payment. It was most heartening to have several members volunteer to provide TV sets, table cloths, plus their help before and after the luncheon. Thanks. It was not known if the television signal level in the PCUG rooms was adequate for satisfactory TV reception. Alf started the discussion with Elizabeth's Letter to the Editor of '16 Bits' which sought comments on " ... what Coffee and Chat should be like". Elizabeth opened by saying that the present Question & Answer format was best for her for problem solving. She had attended a course and found it unsatisfactory, but C & C discussions and personal help from members had been of most benefit. Discussion on "The Object of C & C" (Also see Follow ups) Trevor found that some courses were no good. Ann has found that some books (ie. ... for Dummies) were quite good and usually better than help screens. Gordon did some courses twice, and found that the second time was better, even with the same material, because he could ask more appropriate questions. Wolf said that with computers it was always a learning process. Jim suggested that we go round the table as we already do, but with time limits because of our increasing numbers with lessening chances of being able to ask questions. Jenny suggested having problems be dealt with in the order that they were pre-nominated to the chairman, ie. like tickets at a deli. Emil suggested that we should essentially be a social group with a common interest in computers where we discuss our individual experiences with programs, equipment, suppliers etc. rather than try to solve the wide range of problems that would be of less interest or relevance to most present. Terry prefers a spontaneous discussion, and related his experience with another computer group where problems are raised on a round-the-table basis, discussed then followed up by in-home help by one of the group. Mike feels that our present format is good and has been most effective. Ken, being the longest term member present, briefly related this SIG's history from its first days when five or seven members met at Glebe Park, had a cup of coffee and chatted, usually about computers. Over the years, and at different locations, the discussion topics became more technical than social as the numbers grew. He said that we have outgrown our formative period, and would need to change accordingly. Neville said that guest speakers should still be invited occasionally, and cited the talk last meeting when the guest speaker demonstrated the change-over of a mother board. He said that although few members would ever perform major surgery on their computers, the peripheral topics discussed as each step was taken contributed to everyone's better understanding of how their computers worked. The same applies to other subjects such as software, future directions etc John agreed that we do not have a strict format now, but said that was OK. He mentioned some discussions on training courses and said that it has been difficult to define "intermediate" which has a slightly different meaning to different people. He said that there seemed to be a place for a W95 course as so many of the problems raised here related to that OS. Wolf thought that the demo or guest speaker should not be introduced until after 1100 hours so that general topics could be discussed first, and that the format should not be too structured. Ted suggested that the time was too short, and we should start a half hour earlier. Alf said that one of the biggest problems with the group is that it has grown in size. Earlier in the growth phase, it was considered splitting the group into two, but it became apparent that some people would still come to both meetings because they were getting so much from them. He agreed that extending the time would probably help, and added that the post-meeting luncheon at the soccer club virtually extended the meeting and allowed further discussion in a more social environment. He called on members to suggest any guest speakers who may interest the group. Alan said that the present format seemed to work, and whether we were addressing one of Elizabeth's problems or hearing a report on one of Emil's new toys, it was OK providing we did not spend an excessive amount of time on any one question. A vote was taken, there was unanimous agreement to retain the present format, except that the meeting should start earlier. After discussion, it was proposed that the PCUG centre should be opened at 0930, and the meeting to commence at 1000 on a trial basis. It was further agreed that the members who wished to raise matters or ask questions should advise the co-ordinator beforehand, preferably in writing, and that newcomers be given first opportunity. When Owen advised that he had found a way of converting Word files to PDF files, there was a lot of interest so he offered to post a message in the C & C Newsgroup. Please check there.
(See How to make a PDF File ) Gordon related some of the prices he saw at the recent Computer Market at EPIC, which seemed to have a drooling effect on many at the meeting including 4M 32 pin SIMMS for $30, Zip disks for $17 each and Internal Zip drives for $160. Wolf said that he still had some Zip disks for $20 for group members. Peter asked if anyone present had installed IE4 and Jeff said that he had done so, it had taken half an hour, reorganised everything, and in his search for information on its operation, found that a book was already on sale in the book store. Emil said that it auto-connected to the ISP, and John added that this was not very good with charged local calls, which do not exist in all other countries. Wolf said that he uses Netscape for himself, but when he installed IE3 for his wife found that he could not play an audio CD anymore with the warning that his CD Rom drive was 'being used by another application'. After many hours working on the problem he un- installed IE3 which restored his audio. He believes the culprit was 'Media Player' which is a plug-in of IE3. Emil said that information could assist with a problem he has, but Wolf did not explain how he solved the new problem of no Internet Explorer for his wife! Wolf said that he had promised President Ken he would find a suitable person to wear a red suit on 2 December, and looked around the table at the members with white beards. Ken said he will do the job (and will rehearse the "Ho Ho Ho" santa talk in the meantime!). Alf said that the new members had not been given any opportunity to say anything so invited them to speak. Denise said that it had been a very interesting meeting especially to hear us going over and over the same thing and finally arriving at the same point from which we started. We laughed, and agreed. John said that he had heard we were a pretty good group (with which we thoroughly agree) and came along from Cooma to see for himself. He said that he thinks we should stick with our present format because with a group this size, there can't be too much wrong with it Mike asked for a report on how the Seniors' Internet project was going, and John said that even though more volunteers were needed, it was going extremely well, and that the four terminals at the Woden Library were fully booked by the older people whose computer skills ranged from zero to moderate. John found it extremely rewarding, and said that it was a tremendous advertisement for the group. He understood that in the future one terminal would be installed at each of the Dickson, Belconnen and Kingston libraries. Alf closed the meeting with reminders of the Melbourne Cup luncheon next Tuesday, and the next C & C meeting in two weeks time. Thirteen members the resumed discussions at the Belconnen Soccer Club for lunch. PLEASE NOTE: On the afternoon of the next Coffee & Chat meeting on Tuesday 11 November, there will be the first meeting of the Flight Simulator SIG at the PCUG Centre at 1330 hours. This will certainly include a demo on the large screen in the Training Room, and would be well worth seeing. Although C & C members may retire to the club for lunch and then return to the PCUG Centre for the FltSim SIG meeting/demo by 1330, any member of the PCUG is invited to attend. The SIG Leader is Roger Lowery who can be contacted on Tel: 6258 1583 or lowery@pcug.org.au . ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Apology: I am sorry this posting has taken so long to get on-net. In addition to existing obligations, the financial turmoil on the share markets during the week made it an All Un-ordinary week for me. >-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------< Neville Anderson - nevander@pcug.org.au Coffee & Chat Homepage at: www.pcug.org.au/~rcook/c&c.htm Archived reports for past meetings, with Search Engine >-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------<
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